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Legendary History Prior to 1st Century BC
Beli Mawr and Llyr Llediath in Welsh Pedigrees
The Bartrum "Welsh Genealogies"
Bartrum's "Pedigrees of the Welsh Tribal Patriarchs"
A study in charting medieval citations
The Evolution of the "Padriarc Brenin" Pedigree
Generational Gaps and the Welsh Laws
Minimum Age for Welsh Kingship in the Eleventh Century
The Lands of the Silures
Catel Durnluc aka Cadell Ddyrnllwg
Ancient Powys
The Royal Family of Powys
The Royal Family of Gwynedd
The 5 Plebian Tribes of Wales
Maxen Wledig of Welsh Legend
Maxen Wledig and the Welsh Genealogies
Anwn Dynod ap Maxen Wledig
Constans I and his 343 Visit to Britain
Glast and the Glastening
Composite Lives of St Beuno
Rethinking the Gwent Pedigrees
The Father of Tewdrig of Gwent
Another Look at Teithfallt of Gwent
Ynyr Gwent and Caradog Freich Fras
Llowarch ap Bran, Lord of Menai
Rulers of Brycheiniog - The Unanswered Questions
Lluan ferch Brychan
The Herbert Family Pedigree
Edwin of Tegeingl and his Family
Angharad, Heiress of Mostyn
Ithel of Bryn in Powys
Idnerth Benfras of Maesbrook
Henry, the Forgotten Son of Cadwgan ap Bleddyn
The Muddled Pedigree of Sir John Wynn of Gwydir
The Mysterious Peverel Family
The Clan of Tudor Trevor
The Other "Sir Roger of Powys"
Ancestry of Ieuaf ap Adda ap Awr of Trevor
The Retaking of Northeast Wales
Hedd Molwynog or Hedd ap Alunog of Llanfair Talhearn
"Meuter Fawr" son of Hedd ap Alunog
The Medieval "redating" of Braint Hir
Aaron Paen ap Y Paen Hen
Welsh Claims to Ceri after 1179
The Battle of Mynydd Carn
Trahaearn ap Caradog of Arwystli
Cadafael Ynfyd of Cydewain
Maredudd ap Robert, Lord of Cedewain
Cadwgan of Nannau
Maredudd ap Owain, King of Deheubarth
What Really Happened in Deheubarth in 1022?
Two Families headed by a Rhydderch ap Iestyn
The Era of Llewelyn ap Seisyll
Cynfyn ap Gwerystan, the Interim King
The Consorts and Children of Gruffudd ap Llewelyn
The 1039 Battle at Rhyd y Groes
The First Wife of Bleddyn ap Cynfyn
Hywel ap Gronwy of Deheubarth
The Brief Life of Gruffudd ap Maredudd
The Other Gwenwynwyn
Eunydd son of Gwenllian
Sandde Hardd of Mortyn
The Floruit of Einion ap Seisyllt
The Enigmatic Elystan Glodrydd
Cowryd ap Cadfan of Dyffryn Clwyd
Owain ap Cadwgan and Nest ferch Rhys - An Historic Fiction?
The "sons" of Owain ap Cadwgan ap Bleddyn
The Betrayal by Meirion Goch Revisited
Gwyn Ddistain, seneschal for Llewelyn Fawr
The Men of Lleyn - How They Got There
Trahaearn Goch of Lleyn
Einion vs Iestyn ap Gwrgan - The Conquest of Glamorgan
Dafydd Goch ap Dafydd - His Real Ancestry
Thomas ap Rhodri - Father of Owain "Lawgoch"
The "Malpas" Family in Cheshire
Einion ap Celynin of Llwydiarth
Marchweithian, Lord of Is Aled, Rhufoniog
Osbwrn Wyddel of Cors Gedol
Bradwen of Llys Bradwen in Meirionydd
Ednowain ap Bradwen
Sorting out the Gwaithfoeds
Three Men called Iorwerth Goch "ap Maredudd"
The Caradog of Gwynedd With 3 Fathers
Who Was Sir Robert Pounderling?
Eidio Wyllt - What Was His Birthname?
The Legendary Kingdom of Seisyllwg
The Royal Family of Ceredigion
Llewelyn ap Hoedliw, Lord of Is Cerdin
The Ancestry of Owain Glyndwr
Welsh Ancestry of the Tudor Dynasty
Gruffudd ap Rhys, the Homeless Prince
The Children of Lord Rhys
Maredudd Gethin ap Lord Rhys
The 'Next Heir' of Morgan of Caerleon
Pedigree of the ancient Lords of Ial
The Shropshire Walcot Family
Pedigree of "Ednowain Bendew II"
Pedigree of Cynddelw Gam

                             DAFYDD GOCH AP DAFYDD - HIS REAL ANCESTRY
                                               By Darrell Wolcott
 
           The traditional identification of this man, born c. 1260, is given by J.Y.W. Lloyd in History of Powys Fadog, vol I, pp 192:
 
           "Prince David (ap Gruffudd, brother of Llewelyn the Last) left also an illegitimate son, Dafydd Goch of Nant Conwy, who bore sable, a lion rampant argent in a border engrailed or, and was the father of Gruffudd ap David Goch..."
 
            In his vol III, pp 32/33, Lloyd continues "David Goch of Pen Machno in Nant Conwy....was the natural son of David, Lord of Denbigh and Frodsham, whose trial and cruel death at Shrewsbury in 1283 has already been related in a previous chapter. David Goch married Angharad, daughter of Heilin ab Sir Tudor ab Ednyfed Fychan, by whom he had issue a son and heir, Gruffudd ab David of Nant Conwy".
 
           The intentions of King Edward I in 1283 seem clear enough; he was intent on total extermination of the Gwynedd princely family which had long resisted his authority over Wales.  When Llewelyn ap Gruffudd was finally killed in Brecon, his brother Dafydd had taken up the fallen crown. While he had a few diehard supporters with whose assistance he tried to continue resistance to the English army, many former allies of his brother had lost their will to pursue what they now saw as a losing cause.  When Castell y Bere in Meirionydd, where many believe Dafydd had planned his last stand, was surrendered without a fight in April of 1283, Dafydd went into hiding.  He was finally captured in late June, his location betrayed by a cleric, Iorwerth of Llan-faes[1]. His youngest son, Owain, was taken with his father.  About a week later, his eldest son Llewelyn was found and both boys were taken to the prison in Bristol.  Not finished yet, the king sent the young unmarried daughters of both Llewelyn the Last and Dafydd ap Gruffudd to involuntary seclusion for training as nuns.  Gwenllian ferch Llewelyn ap Gruffudd was sent to the Gilbertine nunnery at Sempringham, while the unnamed daughter or daughters of Dafydd ap Grufudd were sent to the priory at Sixhills.  This insured they would never bear sons to become a future problem for the crown of England; the family had thus been made extinct.
 
          If Dafydd ap Gruffudd had a base son named Dafydd Goch, why was he left alive and free to bear sons?  It had been an earlier bastard child, Gruffudd ap Llewelyn Fawr, who fathered the two men the king had gone to war to remove.  We simply cannot accept that Edward I either did not know about any base son of Dafydd, or did not believe him a problem due to his illegitimacy.  The reason, we are certain, that the king took no action against Dafydd Goch ap Dafydd is that he was NOT the natural son of Dafydd, Lord of Denbigh. 
 
          That false identification of Dafydd Goch of Pen Machno is a late genealogical error.  In the early 16th century, when the medieval genealogists began scouring manuscripts held by clerics and leading families in Wales, they found a "Dafydd Goch ap Dafydd ap Gruffudd ap Llewelyn ap Iorwerth" who had lived at Penmachno in Nant Conwy.  Marriages indicated for him, and for his son Gruffudd, pointed to a birthdate near 1260/65[2].  Aha, they reasoned, there could have been only one Dafydd ap Gruffudd ap Llewelyn ap Iorwerth who fathered such a Dafydd Goch, so extended his ancestry to "Iorwerth ap Owain Gwynedd".  The mother they found cited for this Dafydd Goch was Tangwystl ferch Owain Fflam of Deheubarth, a man not further known then or now.  Since this Dafydd Goch was further cited as father to Gruffudd and great-grandfather to Hywel Coetmor, this must have been (they reasoned) a bastard child of Prince Dafydd who had survived the 1282/83 "extinction" of his family for reasons of his illegitimacy.  In fact, none of the early manuscripts call Dafydd Goch illegitimate nor refer to Tangwystl as the mistress of his father.
 
          Our search for his likely ancestry began with the lands he and his descendants are known to have held.  Other medieval sources tell us that Nefydd Hardd, one of the 15 Founders of Noble Tribes of Gwynedd, was Lord of Nant Conwy; that his son, Iorwerth, inherited the lands at the head of the Machno River called Penmachno[3].  When Peter Bartrum assembled his charts, he attached no family to this Iorwerth[4].  We posit, however, such a family is cited in his sources but has been confused with a better-known family who used the same 4-name string of male names, and who lived at virtually the same time:
 
          1100  Owain Gwynedd                1105  Nefydd Hardd
                          l                                           l
            1130  Iorwerth                         1140  Iorwerth*
                          l                                           l
          1165  Llewelyn Fawr                    1170  Llewelyn
                          l                                           l
            1195  Gruffudd                         1200  Gruffudd
                          l                                           l
             1230  Dafydd**                        1230  Dafydd
                                                                     l
                                                       1260  Dafydd Goch*
 
          * of Penmachno, Nant Conwy
           ** Brother of Llewelyn the Last; executed in 1283
 
           In his Development of Welsh Heraldry, vol I, pp 193, Michael Siddons said of the arms ascribed to Dafydd Goch (cited in our opening paragraphs above) "for which no historical evidence exists".  The stone effigy of his son, Gruffudd ap Dafydd Goch, which lies at Betws-y-coed just outside Penmachno bears a buckle showing 'a chevron and in chief two oak leaves'.  It isn't known if those were meant to be his arms or simply a decorative touch; no family is known to bear arms of that description[5].  However, Hywel Coetmor ap Gruffudd Fychan ap Gruffudd ap Dafydd Goch, has the following arms ascribed to him by early writers:  Azure, a chevron sable between 3 spear-heads argent[6].
 
        The usual arms ascribed to Nefydd Hardd are 'Argent, 3 spear-heads sable' while other sources make it 'Argent a chevron sable between 3 spear-heads of the same'.  Although the tinctures are different[7] for the late 14th century Hywel Coetmor than shown for the early 12th century Nefydd Hardd, we think the principal charges of the arms strenghtens our identification of this family:  (1) same residence; (2) very similar arms; (3) unmolested when Edward I was bent on the extinction of the family of the other Dafydd ap Gruffudd.  All these factors led us to conclude that Dafydd Goch was descended from Nefydd Hardd, not from the line of Gwynedd kings.
 
         Nefydd Hardd, we believe, was descended from the 10th century Heilig ap Glannog who held most of north Gwynedd east of Arfon and north of Ardudwy, including Arllechwedd, Nant Conwy, Rhos, Rhufoniog and the part of Dyffryn Clwyd west of the Clwyd River.
 
 
NOTES:
[1]  The Register of John Pecham, Archbishop of Canterbury, 1279-1292, vol ii, pp 489/492 makes this identification.  For whatever reasons, medieval historians identified that Iorwerth with Y Penwyn of Melai, Rhos, a descendant of Marchudd ap Cynan.  The ancestry of Iorwerth of Llan-faes is unknown. 
[2] Pen. 127, 17 cites 2 wives for Dafydd Goch: Angharad ferch Tudor ap Madog ap Iarddur ap Cynddelw born c. 1275, and Angharad ferch Heilyn ap Sir Tudor ap Ednyfed Fychan born c. 1265.  These point to a birthdate near 1260 for Dafydd Goch.  Pen. 177, 104 cites one wife of Gruffudd ap Dafydd Goch as Angharad ferch Hywel y pedolau, a lady born c. 1290.  Again, this suggests Dafydd Goch was born c. 1260
[3] Pen. 287, 677 cites Iorwerth ap Nefydd Hardd as "of Penmachno".  NLW Journal vol xiii, pp 137 places Nefydd Hardd in Nant Conwy
[4] Welsh Genealogies AD300-1400 on the chart 'Nefydd Hardd 1'
[5] No such arms occur in Papworth's Ordinary of Arms nor in Siddon's The Development of Welsh Heraldry
[6] Pen. 149B, 62 and Harl. 1143
[7] While there are many cases where a son was granted entirely new arms for his military exploits, other cases are seen where he was assigned his father's arms with one or more colors changed.